Episode 148 – A Podcast About “-Gate” Scandals

Deflategate, Coffeegate, Spygate, you’ve heard em all before. But, did you ever realize the extreme quantity of “-gate” scandals out there? Neither did we! That’s why we’re here to shine light on some “-gates” of our own, from the obscure to the up and coming. Scandal is everywhere, and with the suffix “-gate” thrown around so cavalierly we are bound to find some odd ones not quite deserving of the name. How did “-gate” scandals become so prevalent in today’s world? Does the term lessen the impact? We dive into all that as well as the history of “-gate” scandals before bringing some of our own to the table! Who knew a fajita was so scandalous!?

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Full episode transcript available below

Kalvin 0:06
Two podcasts about something for each week we dive deep into whatever it is we find interesting. I’m your host, Calvin and joining me from the Watergate office building in Washington DC, on a shady stuff going over there to co host Nick Richardson.

Nick 0:20
Yeah, some may call it a scandal,

Kalvin 0:23
a scandal gate, even

Nick 0:25
a scandal gate at the Watergate.

Kalvin 0:27
I wonder if there is a scandal gate like that. I didn’t look at that. Because I feel like that’s probably I have

Nick 0:32
some gates that I’ll list and if scandal gate isn’t among them, I think we give it an honor. honorary indoctrination.

Kalvin 0:41
So it’s not on our lap. What we’re talking about today is scandals that end with gate.

Unknown Speaker 0:48

Kalvin 0:49
Yeah. Because it’s it’s a weird phenomenon. And I don’t get

Nick 0:54
it. It’s fucking everywhere. It’s way worse than I thought. Really.

Kalvin 0:58
There’s a Wikipedia page. That’s just a list of gates.

Nick 1:03
It’s fascinating. I did not think it would be as fascinating as it was. But let me tell you.

Kalvin 1:09
Yeah, so we’re pretty much covering any scandal no matter how large or small that someone decided to saddle with the suffix gate, after something kind of tangentially related to the actual event. Like I said, there’s an entire list on Wikipedia. And kind of the fact that that list exists is what made me want to do this episode. Like I just thought it was the big ones, you know, Watergate spy gate. deflate GamerGate, deflate gate, bounty gate. I didn’t know there. There’s some like 100 on this list, at least. And I didn’t know it went that deep.

Nick 1:41
I really only ever heard it mentioned that one time in politics, and then sports. It’s always sports.

Kalvin 1:48
Yeah, it happens a lot in sports. It happens just kind of randomly to like, there’ll be a weird thing like GamerGate comics gate, those things are, are a little more, you know, outside of the sports world and politics world. It’s a it’s not necessarily politics, but

Nick 2:02
it’s definitely grown. For sure.

Kalvin 2:03
scandal gate is not in any of the lists. But there is a TV Tropes page associated with scandal gate

Nick 2:11
that we go, I’ll count it.

Kalvin 2:14
Yeah, so it’s, it’s something. So we each picked two gate scandals that we’re going to talk about. And we’re just going to kind of go into detail, say what they are. And then we’ll talk about, you know, where it came from, where to go, and all that kind of stuff. And then we’ll cover the the one that started all as well. So the gates suffix, it derives from the Watergate scandal of the United States in the early 70s, which resulted in the resignation of US President Richard Nixon, and we’ll get more into Watergate in a minute. That’ll be our first fundamental something about gates scandals today is we’re just going to talk about Watergate since it was the one that kicked it off.

Nick 2:57
I mean, hell yeah.

Kalvin 2:59
Yeah. This scandal specifically was named after the Watergate complex in Washington DC, where Nick is currently sitting. The complex is always named after the Watergate area where Symphony Orchestra concerts were staged on the Potomac River between 1935 and 1965.

Nick 3:16
Historic location befitting of a gate scandal of origination.

Kalvin 3:21
So the suffix became productive as a lib fix. I’d never heard that word before, but it was used on the Wikipedia page but I hadn’t liberals use it.

Nick 3:30
Yeah, I just want to fix everything fucking

Kalvin 3:32
It is used to embellish a noun or name to suggest existence of a far reaching scandal, particularly in politics, and government or sports. I,

Nick 3:41
I read up on this the Catholic coined the term and he is Yeah, hilarious. I am sorry, but he is funny as shit. William Sapphire. I mean, what a badass name former nixon administration so I mean, he took the bad and he turned it into something hilarious.

Kalvin 4:03
Yeah, we’re gonna get to Sapphire here in a minute. CBC News calm no in 2001. The term may suggest unethical behavior and a cover up when whatever gate is added to something. such issues usages have been criticized by commenters as cliched and misleading. James stainer comments that revelations are given the gate suffix to add a thin veil of credibility following Watergate but most bear no resemblance to the painstaking investigation of that particular piece of presidential corruption. Meaning like Watergate was so much above and beyond a lot of these things that have happened and we’re gonna talk about some of those that, you know, don’t come anywhere close to what Watergate is and the work that went into uncovering the scandal behind Watergate. Whereas you know, something very simple like monkey gate. The controversy surrounding speculation, speculation that the second Test cricket tour could be in jeopardy due to the fallout of an incident Between harbor nice thing I really picked a bad one and Andrew Simon’s. So I mean, that takes no investigation almost. Yeah. In sustainer links the widespread use of gate to what sociologists john Thompson calls scandal syndrome.

Nick 5:15
I love it. I love it.

Kalvin 5:19
I’m not a fan.

Nick 5:20
I think it’s so funny mostly for all the bullshit he associated with it. Yeah, at least he tried to gate he tried to gate all these things. He’s the gatekeeper. Oh,

Kalvin 5:33
he’s definitely gatekeeper. He is gatekeeping. The gates really is what he’s doing here.

Nick 5:41
If you want to change his last name to gates, I might have you know, might have had to donate to his like, his fund or whatever. I’m sure there’s one out there.

Kalvin 5:51
The adoption of gates to suggest the existence of a scandal was promoted by William sapphires. He pointed out the conservative New York Times columnist and former nixon administration speechwriter as early as September 1974. He wrote a Viet gate a proposed pardon of the Watergate criminals in Vietnam War draft Dodgers. Subsequently he coined numerous gate terms below gate brief gate, conjugate dever gate debate gate, double Billings gate, which he later said my best friend was the encapsulation of a minor scandal as double Billingsgate. I’m confused by that so that’s what happens when you just copy things from Wikipedia.

Nick 6:33
Gate coinage was the encapsulation oh okay there we’re gonna handle is double Billingsgate he must really hate fucking Frankie dude.

Kalvin 6:40
Yeah Frankie gate Franklin gate he gave him to he’s like fuck the

Nick 6:44
fuck you Frankie Franklin. You pump pitch

Kalvin 6:48
ganter Gate house gate iraq a Korea gate Lance gate Maggie gate Nana gate Raider gate scalp gate. travelgate troopergate and whitewater gate so those are all the gates that my man Sapphire came up with?

Nick 7:01
man. He went through the Nixon administration all the way to the Clinton administration.

Kalvin 7:06
Yeah, he’s just getting Shut up.

Nick 7:07
I mean, he he’s got some miles on them wheels. I want to hear I want to learn more about nanny gate. I bet this can you know you had the opportunity as you were looking at gates to I was distracted by the landscape and researching Frankie gate and stuff like that.

Kalvin 7:25
Let’s see what navigate is.

Nick 7:26
Now let’s do I just want to know if he had to say so who fucked in any

Kalvin 7:33
political controversy in the United States were in the nomination. So we Baird in your nomination of Kimball wood for US Attorney General are withdrawn due to the hiring of illegal aliens as nannies for failure to pay taxes. Now, it’s not that interesting,

Nick 7:46
man. That’s wack. They gave some people some hardworking folks a job.

Kalvin 7:52
No one was born in any in that situation. Unfortunately,

Nick 7:55
they at least I mean, I just yeah, that’s fair.

Kalvin 7:59
The New York Magazine suggested that his aim in creating all these gates was rehabilitating Nixon by relentlessly torturing his successors with the same rhetorical brush diminish guilt by association. Wow. Oh, dude, and I think he’s done it. I think the the gate term has been washed away to a certain extent. Like it doesn’t mean that much anymore. We’re applying it to maybe under inflated footballs.

Nick 8:25
Anything Brady related? Like Brady’s met miracle liquid gate? Who freaked the fuck out?

Kalvin 8:33
Jordan secret stuff?

Nick 8:34
Yeah. Tommy t secret.

Kalvin 8:36
T. Tv 12 I wouldn’t be surprised if on TV on the TV 12 site there’s a water bottle with a taped on. Like piece of paper that says TV 12 secret stuff. It’s just like in Space Jam.

Nick 8:49
This is written in Sharpie. CRAN

Kalvin 8:52
Yeah. And it’s literally just water. Same as in Space Jam.

Nick 8:54
Tommy fucking odd. I would much rather watch a Space Jam movie with Tom Brady in it than LeBron James. I’m sorry. I don’t know why because of actually fucking hilarious. Oh, you know what? bugs go long.

Kalvin 9:14
I’m just thinking of football. Space Jam

Unknown Speaker 9:17
right now. fuckers.

Kalvin 9:20
It would be like the Air Bud franchise right where they broke away from basketball and just made all these different sports of Space Jam. I like it.

Nick 9:27
Dude, I would be so down with that. Space slant

Kalvin 9:31
space. Space baseball.

Unknown Speaker 9:34
spaceball space soccer.

Kalvin 9:37
Where half space balls it’s completely different than space cricket, space soccer.

Nick 9:41
No, watch that shit. He got to get some

Kalvin 9:45

Nick 9:47
He would be like $100 million. I’ll be in the movie for four and a half minutes. All right. Let me give you $300 million.

Kalvin 9:56
Well, this has nothing to do with gates. We’re gonna call this Space Jam. We got sidetracked and just talking about all the cool space. Do you know what

Nick 10:04
it is? It’s scandalous. It is a fucking scandal. There isn’t a football Space Jam The fuck?

Kalvin 10:11
Well, I mean, and if you move to baseball, we’ve seen Bugs Bunny play baseball and that one cartoon he plays every position like they could they could destroy the monsters in baseball, they wouldn’t even need to go get a a one baseball star, which don’t really exist. I mean, Mike trout, I guess. He’s the guy, right?

Nick 10:28
I think he’s retired.

Kalvin 10:31
I don’t I’m not. I don’t follow baseball at its origin as fuck. Agree. Sapphire himself later said to author Eric Alterman that he may have been seeking to minimize the relative importance of the crimes committed by his foreign boss with his silliness. Again, good job. We’re up to Space Jam gate now.

Nick 10:50
I mean, it’s really quite harmless when you think about it, because who gives a shit with this fuckin cat? Thanks. But people give a shit what this fucking cat thinks I don’t. I don’t really it’s

Kalvin 11:01
not only that, it’s is that he accomplished what he was trying to like, Watergate should be a bigger deal. But if you ask anybody under 40 like that, that doesn’t play super close attention to politics. Watergate is just this thing that happened and Nixon resigned like I until reading up on it for this. I didn’t really know what happened. Oh, man, he Yeah. I mean, well go into it. Right. So. So I think the cultural lexicon of the gate suffix has taken it to a point where the most important one of these Watergate is now watered down by the existence of all the rest of them. So this guy Sapphire, accomplished what he set out to and it’s really, it’s a detriment to who Nixon was that nobody looks at him as the complete piece of shit. That he should Oh, well, nobody looks back at him like that. Except

Nick 11:56
you. I mean, fuck Richard Nixon. But at the same time, they do do do some genuinely decent things for this country. But the terrible shit he did completely offset that entirely.

Kalvin 12:10
But did it though, because people are like, people still hold them up as an example of a good president. From time to time,

Nick 12:15
he accomplished a lot of very solid legislation in regards to, you know, civil rights and stuff like that. He also did a lot of fucked up shit in regards to civil rights, is he was the presiding president during Kent State, and basically was like, you know, fuck all the MCAT. And don’t get me started on the fact that he negotiated a deal with the, you know, the Vietcong basically say don’t agree to the United States terms. I’ll get you a better deal and then kept the war going for another year, right. 400,000 Americans are some crazy shit. So fucking bananas.

Kalvin 12:51
Speaking of bananas, 1974 banana gate is the next, the first next scandal to use the gate suffix after Watergate.

Nick 13:02
That was a big fucking deal, too.

Kalvin 13:05
Yeah, so this was just real quick rundown of this 119 7400 has passed a law to raise the tax on banana exports from 25 cents to 50 cents per 40 pound box on doors had supplied more than 20% of United brands company exports in 1974. In 1975, Eli black, the chairman and president of united brands company jumped to his death from the 44th floor of the Pan Am building in Manhattan is the Securities and Exchange Commission had investigated when they were investigating black suicide. It uncovered the scandal that they later named banana gate. United brands had apparently paid 125 million or sorry, one point $25 million bribe to Honduran president Oswaldo Lopez Arellano, is he that’s the guy that led that heist you talked about on that one episode, right?

Nick 13:55
I don’t remember.

Kalvin 13:56
No, it was followed by another $121.25 million.

Nick 14:02
That’s what it should be is 125 1.25 minutes. That ain’t shit dog.

Kalvin 14:06
Well, they gave the game two and a half million dollars to to change the taxes on these bananas. Because now that makes them much more money.

Nick 14:19
Makes the United States pay less money. They had them pay instead, they bribed them so they would only be charged 25 cents instead of 50 cents. Oh, is that what happened? Yeah, protection.

Kalvin 14:32
I didn’t I didn’t read that deep into it. I thought it was they they raised he know because this guy was on the inside of United brands. So he had them raised the tax so he could make more money.

Nick 14:46
Yeah, this cat was off of the US. Hey, no, he raised it for exports to everyone in the world. So then the United States negotiated with him in regards to lowering that taxation and bribed him So taxation would only show up as 25 cents instead of 50 cents. So paying less of a premium and that’s why, you know they broke them in the first place.

Kalvin 15:11
So that’s banana gate. The first the first second gate suffixed scandal.

Nick 15:18
Well yeah it led to the over and over the overthrow of the government at the time to dam Yeah, yeah, it started

Kalvin 15:27
should read the whole Wikipedia

Nick 15:27
article. Oh, do you banana gate is fucking intense. That’s why you only get bananas pretty much from Honduras. It was something where the United States started That’s how you know dole became such a fuckin Empire.

Kalvin 15:42
Shout out dole bananas.

Nick 15:43
Y’all are terrible. They’re good. The I mean, I work in Fun fact I work in food distribution specifically in produce. And I have literally never seen another brand of banana.

Unknown Speaker 15:57

Nick 15:59
Yeah, that’s, that’s what I mean is Chiquita thinking shahida Don’t bullshit. I’m, I’m all confused. I got my second materna shot today. I’m feeling a little fuzzy.

Kalvin 16:09
So we’re moving into the five fundamentals. Some things about gate scandals. We’re gonna start with number one Watergate, which ran from 1972 to 1974. The scandal stem from the Nixon administration’s continuous attempts to cover up its involvement in the June 17 1972 breaking of the Democratic National Convention headquarters at the Watergate office building in Washington, DC, Washington, DC. Five people were arrested for this break.

Nick 16:35
Yeah, only five That’s ridiculous.

Kalvin 16:39
Well, they’re only five perpetuating the break in people were later indicted and things like that. We’ll get to that. But these were the people who were arrested for actually being there that night there were five. Cash was found on these perpetrators and was later connected to Nixon’s reelection campaign committee. During the large scale investigation investigation that was mostly broadcast on PBS. witnesses testified that the President had approved plans to cover up administration involvement in the break in and that there was a voice activated taping system in the Oval Office. Nixon’s administration resisted all this investigation, obviously, because he seemed to be guilty as eff

Unknown Speaker 17:19
guilty is

Kalvin 17:21
guilty A F. House of Representatives commenced impeachment process of Nixon in 1973, Nixon was ordered to turn over Oval Office tapes by the Supreme Court tapes revealed that Nixon had conspired to cover up activities that took place after the break in and had attempted to use federal officials to deflect the investigation. the Articles of Impeachment were brought against Congress for obstruction of justice, abuse of power and contempt of Congress. And Nixon resigned from office on August 9 1974. He most likely would have been removed from office if he had not resigned.

Nick 17:53
Yeah, that was bad, bad move on his fucking part. But also bad move in regards to

Kalvin 17:59
why not save face right No, no,

Nick 18:01
I’m saying a good move in regards to resigning because if the investigation would have proceeded because if you have precedent of that nature, you can’t have double jeopardy and of course charge them with the same crimes. You can go for other shit and he would have been got for the Vietnam stuff for sure. Probably treason conspiracy to commit treason, a whole lot of equity. Yeah,

Kalvin 18:21
once I get the hands on those tapes, and anything goes right, yeah, he’s

Nick 18:24
fucked. Well, that’s when the magnifying glass comes out. And they’re just like, yeah, we’re gonna go ahead and look at everything. Richard? Well,

Kalvin 18:31
well, the tapes are here. We might as well listen to him. Right, right. Tricky dick.

Nick 18:34
What do you What else do you hide in there guy.

Kalvin 18:38
69 people were indicted, and 48 of them were convicted of some level of involvement, many of them top officials in the Nixon administration.

Nick 18:47
And that should while Dude, it’s crazy how a lot of people that’s a shitload of people with who did a lot of bad stuff. I’d love

Kalvin 18:56
to see a similar row of dominoes start to fall here over the next year or two, also with the previous president.

Unknown Speaker 19:03

Nick 19:05
no, because he’s still there’s still a powerful, you know, minority in the House and Senate. So I don’t think that’s gonna happen anytime soon. morals have gone out the fucking window doesn’t matter.

Kalvin 19:21
Yeah, I also, I don’t know. I guess the insurrection attempt and and the last impeachment for the, the quid pro quo or whatever. I was gonna say there’s not a specific crime to necessarily tie all these people to but I think there’s plenty of specific crimes to try and tie them to and to start investigating. So

Nick 19:41
no, no, I think Joseph Vance has gone about it the right way. I mean, the with the DA Manhattan, that cat right. It’s just slow and steady, methodical. Going the money route. I like it. It’s gonna be like Al Capone, probably.

Kalvin 19:55
Right and that’ll get him but there are so many other enablers Right. They have been right by his side.

Nick 20:03
I mean, he fucked his kids as soon as he put them in charge of his company. Yeah, but

Kalvin 20:07
it’s not kid. It’s all these other Congress people that went along with it. All right, all these other administrators that that worked in his office, that those wouldn’t necessarily fall under that same thing, because they’re not. If they didn’t directly make money off of it, you can’t put them in a Rico case. You know, that’s all confusing, and we don’t need to get into it here. But like, there’s, I think there’s more chips to fall there.

Nick 20:29
No, we could simplify pretty easy if you’re associated with the gentleman, the former massive handed individual inchie Voldemort. Yes, that guy Voldemort and Chief, there’s, I would just look at the massive growth in income a majority of his bootlickers had in weeks. I mean, it’s it’s Stark. Look at mitch mcconnell’s income over the past couple of years. How hard it’s skyrocketed. It’s worth like $129 million. Ridiculous. Ridiculous I could. I can talk shit all day.

Kalvin 21:06
So the plan at the DNC headquarters for Watergate was to break in and photograph campaign. This is a part I never understood like I understood they got caught there something was going on. I didn’t know exactly what they were going for and why. So this was the plan from their side. They want to photograph campaign documents and install listening devices and telephones. Sometime after midnight on Saturday January 17 1972. Watergate complex security guard Frank wills notice tape covering the latches on some of the complexes doors leading from the underground parking garage to several offices, which allow the doors to close but stay on locked here move the tape leaving it was nothing good security work my

Nick 21:44
guy? Yeah, what uh, gee, I wouldn’t have checked that should have been like looks close to me.

Kalvin 21:50
Oh, but then he like he does no further investing. Yeah, yeah, people just tape doors all the time. Fine. Whatever. It’s

Nick 21:58
surprisingly common.

Kalvin 22:01
When he returned to short time later and discovered that someone had retained the locks he called the police. He’s like SON

Unknown Speaker 22:05
OF A we kind of

Kalvin 22:07
got me again. Those damn kids you come out here ghost kids with their scotch tape. You big teddy ghost. I

Nick 22:14
hope he’s like holding his fucking fingers together. Come on. I’m working nights but I’m working baby.

Kalvin 22:22
responding to a call with an unmarked car with three plainclothes officers. Sergeant Paul W. leaper officer john D. Barrett and officer Carl m Schaeffler working the overnight bump squad dressed as hippies and also look out for drug deals and other street crimes really just getting to the core of the problems in America. They’re no hippies aren’t doing drugs.

Nick 22:42
It’s just good police work. You know, they’re just they’re, they’re wearing the skin.

Kalvin 22:46
Let’s bust some homeless people get it. No homeless people

Nick 22:48
aren’t hippies. They’re probably veterans at the time. But yeah, they’re probably just dressing up with big fucking afros and super hippie looking. They’re just like, Hey, bro. Hey, brother. Can I get some fuckin weighed and then as soon as the nice heavy pulls out as we get the fuck? I thought you were gonna say they showed up and beat the shit out. That’s just what I expect.

Kalvin 23:15
The burgers look at across the street. Alfred Baldwin was distracted watching TV and failed to observe the arrival of the police car in front of the hotel. Great job, Al.

Nick 23:24
Shoot. This is dope. Yeah, the crew well.

Kalvin 23:28
I Love Lucy over there.

Nick 23:30
I mean, it was probably one division, the Dick Van Dyke Show.

Kalvin 23:35
Neither did he see the plainclothes officers investigating the DNC Sixth Floor suite of 29 offices by the time Baldwin finally noticed unusual activity on the sixth floor and radio the burglars it was already too late. Hey, hey guys, across the street in room 462. There’s some cops and they look like they’ve arrested four people. I just want to give you a heads up.

Nick 23:56
Oh, it’s you over? Sorry. Shit. Now

Kalvin 24:00
in order to find i did i say 462 I meant 624 and not across the street. Obviously that would be stupid.

Nick 24:09
Yeah, who does? This is on top of the building. Yeah. This isn’t anything you know, conspicuous.

Kalvin 24:18
The police apprehended five men later identified as Virgilio Gonzales. Bernard Barker, James McCord, Eugenio Martinez and Frank Sturges. They were charged with attempted burglary and attempted interception of telephone and other communications.

Nick 24:34
You know, I feel bad for these dudes. Someone probably came up to him. It’s like a kid. You want to make 50 bucks and they’re like, yeah, totally let me love you. That’s like a month and a half salary.

Kalvin 24:43
We’re gonna give you a lookout a TV. So just make sure you don’t turn on may take the batteries out

Nick 24:48
the remote. I don’t know. Oops, sorry. It’s the clicker. You can’t take the batteries out of those things you might die at the time.

Kalvin 24:56
The Washington Post reported that police found lockpicks indoor Jimmy’s almost 20 $300 in cash most of it $100 bills with the serial numbers in sequence a shortwave receiver that can pick up police calls again not going to turn that on to see if the police are coming 40 rolls of unexposed film to 35 millimeter cameras and three pin sides to your gas gun.

Nick 25:17
Okay these dudes are rolling hard as fuck right under me know what they’re doing. Oh yeah,

Kalvin 25:26
they’re gonna get some shit done had you know owl been looking out

Nick 25:29
you know these cops are like what the fuck? These guys aren’t even hippies really doing here man.

Kalvin 25:37
Sorry. Yeah, we’re an overhead here we’re expecting to you know get like one hippie buying some some weed and we got we got some guys breaking in wiretapping entire hotel. What What do we do here?

Nick 25:50
We’re gonna need some backup. It was probably more like Hey, guys, let’s huddle up over here real quick. Over here. We’ll be right back guys. So we’re gonna let him go right?

Unknown Speaker 25:59
I think we spray some crack on and what’s good.

Unknown Speaker 26:06
Oh, Johnson, sprinkle some crack on with

Kalvin 26:12
this before. This guy’s breaking into people’s houses and putting up pictures of himself and his family. Oh,

Unknown Speaker 26:19
well, let’s do it.

Kalvin 26:30
The metonym Watergate came to encompass an array of clandestine and often illegal activities undertaken by members of the Nixon administration, including bugging the offices, political opponents, and people of whom Nixon or his officials were suspicious. Ordering investigations of activist groups and political figures and using the FBI and CIA and IRS s political weapons. The use of the suffix gate after an identifying term has since become synonymous with public scandal. Especially political scandal. That’s why we’re here today, kids.

Nick 26:58
Yeah, we’re gonna get this the fuck up. I’m going back for Fuck, I feel like Nixon.

Kalvin 27:06
Just like 1972 he just realizes, hey, you can record people talking. And so he just went apeshit on recording devices. Yeah, yeah. He’s like, Yeah, well, one of my office, I went in that office. We’re gonna pull on every phone we can find. He just he just realized it’s like when you find new music, right? hear the song for the first time you really like it? And then you just download all 10 other albums. Right? That was Nixon with recording devices like Oh, shit, we can record people. Fuck Yeah, let’s go. Yeah, recording everything.

Nick 27:39
Right? He’s highest shit behind that big desk.

Kalvin 27:43
So can’t be illegal to record people. They’re saying things so I shouldn’t be allowed to hear that.

Nick 27:48
I’m fucking genius. And I should just listen back to everything I’ve ever said. And yeah, then he forgot about it. And they’re like, damn it, Richard, you fucking idiot. We told you about this. And he said, oops.

Kalvin 28:04
You know, there’s some aid in that first meeting. 1972 when he first discovered what a tape recorder is, he’s like, yeah, look, you can record everything. But should you but other people can maybe someday listen to it then. So like, maybe let’s rethink recording absolutely everything.

Nick 28:18
Well, I’m a good person.

Kalvin 28:20
No, you don’t want to Okay.

Unknown Speaker 28:21
All right. You know, I

Kalvin 28:23
put it out there. It’s up to you. Fuck you. You got anything else on Watergate before we move on?

Nick 28:31
I really don’t. I think that’s enough of a history lesson because the minutiae of this thing is very, very fascinating. And the utter incompetence of I mean, shit is wild. Now should is sophisticated. And it wasn’t back then. And I imagine he did a lot worse stuff. That’s just the first time he got caught.

Kalvin 28:54
Well, yeah, when you find your fancy new toy, you gotta use it. You use it all the time. Alright, so each pick two scandals. Nick, what is your

Nick 29:04
first scandal that you picked? My first scandal, sir. I’m going to go with a bit of a funny one. So short and sweet. delectable treat. Much like fajitas thus, here’s fuckin love fetus, and thus the title of fajita gate.

Unknown Speaker 29:26
Oh, done

Unknown Speaker 29:29
with pecans

Nick 29:31
and some Glock Yeah, fajita gate. It was a series of legal and political incidents in San Francisco. that began with a street bite over you guessed it. Fucking vetus

Kalvin 29:45
Oh, I saw that one that was on like the shortlist of like, this is funny. I should probably look into Dude, I don’t want a different way.

Nick 29:51
But as soon as soon as I heard about fajita gate. I remember hearing about like stupidest reasons a fistfights been started. You know, just Dump shit on Reddit. And basically so what happens is on the night of November 20 2002 some residents of San Fran, Adam Snyder and Jade Santoro were approached as they were leaving the blue light bar by three men who demanded the bag of fajitas that they were carrying these sons of bitches these drunk pieces of shit said give me your fucking vetoes, bro. And they said, fuck you, man. I given you my

Kalvin 30:28
God, dude. He said, Hey, man, the taco stands right over there. Go get your own damn fajitas He’s like,

Nick 30:32
no, gee, I want your fucking fajitas so some words were exchanged probably along the lines of what we just uttered. And a fight broke out beer bottle was thrown some blunt objects were you know thrown and Snyder and Santoro got fucked up pretty bad. Snyder was minorly injured. And Santoro was like he was pretty injured. He had to go to the hospital and was in not necessarily critical condition, but damn close to it. So where the scandal comes in, is the people that the three men that beat the shit out of these two guys over there for heaters were off duty police officers who left the scene of the crime were pulled over and subsequently let go. After these men were leaving a nightclub shit faced just beat up to fucking men. The men who were beat up called the police on these off duty officers. They’re pulled over and Lecco that night. They were later arrested and and you know a lot of charges were brought up against him and come to find out one of these men was the son of the chief of police in the ER so shit yeah, in San Francisco are he’s like the deputy chief and he was next in line within a couple weeks or something. So anyway, Chief of Police has to retire or step down because all this garbage and every single one of these men was acquitted. What sucks is they weren’t just acquitted basically, like one jury awarded the victory to the two defendants or to the I don’t know fucking lawyer terms the two guys that got beat up and then the next jury basically said, You’re fucking wrong. We’re gonna make them pay for the cops legal fees. So she’s Yeah, these guys at one point were awarded 35 grand and like 1200 $12,500 respectively, and then they had to pay most of it back in in court fees for these three dudes. And that’s some bullshit.

Kalvin 32:48
That is some B to the s the H it there’s a whole lot more behind just a fajita gate when

Nick 32:54
I first thought about it, it’s like you know, I probably call something a V to gate if like I got some and someone knocked out knocked him out of my hand

Kalvin 33:03
just like a crowded so get off your plate and start eating I would.

Nick 33:06
I would literally find someone over that. So get your fucking hands off my dude. I know. Now in this day and age, especially for heaters, dog so

Kalvin 33:16
get your own damn fajitas people

Nick 33:18
just don’t touch my food. Yeah, Nick doesn’t share food.

Kalvin 33:21
Joey does not share food.

Nick 33:24
I just know what fucking food off my plate. That’s gross.

Kalvin 33:27
I Yeah, I agree. Like just get get your own food man. If you want in something, you should have ordered it. Now eat mine because I ordered. Not your wife count.

I went with a funny one also. And this is dildo gate. Nice. So let’s start by admitting that I’ve had the Wikipedia page for dildo gate up and in the background of my work computer for a few days while I was putting this together just like because I’d kind of go back and forth in between things. And this is probably the most thankful I’ve ever been that I work from home. So I’m always like walking in and be like, oh, dildos. Hmm.

Nick 34:11
All right. walking in and someone’s all hunched over.

Kalvin 34:13
You didn’t share it on the zoom meeting or anything.

Nick 34:16
Thank God.

Kalvin 34:17
Yeah. I mean, it’s probably not because, like, there are a lot more benefits to working from home than co workers not seeing that I’m looking at dildo gait, but, you know, this is up there on the reasons.

Nick 34:29
Yeah, that’s pretty tight. So I’m pretty sure someone would feel a little harassed or something along those lines.

Kalvin 34:36
Yeah, I don’t know what they’d feel. This occurred on February 5 2016. In watts unagi. What what tangy New Zealand. So there we go. w A iita ngi. What we tongi will tell you. Yeah, we have to say with a New Zealand ish accent. That is not a New Zealand. Excellent

Nick 35:00
don’t you tell me what is in his name? Give

Kalvin 35:02
me a timeout no talking for the next two minutes. Oh

Unknown Speaker 35:04
my god.

Kalvin 35:08
So at this at this gate, what happened is a protester flung a rubber dildo at MP Steven Joyce striking him in the face. It became international news and has been parodied in art, music and television.

Nick 35:25
I’m just picturing this chick with a fucking cannon. blasted Oh boy, the chin. Well, don’t worry,

Kalvin 35:33
I’ve got details for you.

Nick 35:34
Okay, is it? Just give me a snapshot? Is it like the jackass skit where BAM gets drilled with a dildo in the face? Yeah, I

Kalvin 35:43
think so. I don’t watch jackass. It sounds pretty much like that. So this occurred on what time the day national holiday in New Zealand which commemorates the signing of the Treaty of Waitangi between the British crown and representatives of mayority on February 6 1840. So because the Treaty of Waitangi was for many years ignored by European colonists. Great good stuff. Yeah. being declared a simple melody in the 1877 we prorata verse Bishop of Wellington judgment, what tangy day celebrate celebrations have frequently been a scene of political protest. So basically, nobody believes that this treaty exists so that the people why sanghi protest is what I’m getting here.

Nick 36:27
They’re like, we’re not thankful for you. Fuck you.

Kalvin 36:30
So politicians attending have been jostled and heckled bud was thrown out the Leader of the Opposition Don Brash in 2004. And the Prime Minister john key was grabbed by two protesters in 2009. That you said, bud, at first, I’m like the throne weed at these guys kind of savages our mind, mud within them.

Nick 36:47
And that made a lot more sense once my brain kind of worked through.

Kalvin 36:51
In February of 2016, New Zealand had just signed the 12 nation Trans Pacific Partnership agreement, which had been widely criticized by Maori as undermining the self determination guaranteed to them by the Treaty of Waitangi. Prime Minister john key wanted to respond to the critics of the TTP at what Tommy boat was told he would not be allowed to discuss pollicis politics on the marae two days before the Waitangi ceremonies where a large anti t p p protest was promised, he decided not to attend and sent senior politician Minister of Economic Development Steven Joyce as represented so the Prime Minister doesn’t want to get hit in the face with a dildo so he sends you know, Minister of Economic Development here so he can get hit in the face right. Good job.

Nick 37:35
The garbage boy Get over here. I got something for you.

Kalvin 37:39
While Joyce was Speaking to reporters at a tea marae I’m just going to continue butchering these New Zealand things. I apologize to any native New Zealanders who are listening to this.

Nick 37:49
At least, at least you’re trying earnestly and mockingly

Kalvin 37:53
no not not at all. I just I don’t know how to pronounce that. Sorry. I didn’t take the time to look it up. What tongi on the day before the celebrations Josie Butler, a Christ Church nurse through what appeared to be a dildo in the form of large flesh toned rubber penis and testicles at him. Oh, yeah, they describe what what time it was. Shit was veiny so

Nick 38:19
I wouldn’t fuck with it.

Kalvin 38:20
So they go real into detail about how this is so Josie Butler through what appeared to be a dildo at him. The dildo rebounded from his face, and the moment was captured on film. Joyce responded by saying guto Butler, who was protesting New Zealand’s signing of the TPP shouted that’s for raping our sovereignty. She was arrested but later released without charge. Butler later explained that she was concerned about the tpps effect on the cost of medications for her parents. The significance of the dildo was never explained.

Nick 38:51
Wow. I mean, there was there’s a whole lot more behind it. I thought it was just funny.

Kalvin 38:56
Well, there’s no there’s even more. Yeah, I mean, like this is a legit protest where somebody threw a dildo at someone but the dildo part still makes it funny.

Nick 39:04
So Wikipedia page. It’s poignant for her her position but goddamn.

Kalvin 39:12
Exactly. And the Wikipedia page goes into detail about what exactly the Delta was says although the object thrown a choice was described by media at the time as a dildo or sex toy. Butler later revealed that it was actually a dog’s squeaky toy. It was chosen after she googled most effective form of protest and learned about the 2008 bushing incident. A canine toy was chosen as it was less likely to harm Joyce than a shoe than such a dict.

Unknown Speaker 39:39
It is totally addictive. They call it

Kalvin 39:43
Oh yeah. So Joyce’s frankly nicknamed Bilbo Baggins alert rings reference. Soon after the incident Joyce tweeted someone send the gift over a john oliver so we can get this over with. Oliver was at the time repeatedly lampooning news from New Zealand. Oliver responded with an extravagant segment on The show Last Week Tonight, redesigned New Zealand flag brandish with Sir Peter Jackson and sporting Joyce’s face and the dildo, rain of dildos performers in giant dildo costumes, and inquires about the incident to the tune of the Hallelujah chorus. Joyce responded on Twitter Well, that was actually pretty funny.

Unknown Speaker 40:21
Describe is like they What? Sir? Watch this video I say

Kalvin 40:29
well, that’s I wanted to pick this because, like, at face value, it seems like the funniest name to gate out of the list of gates like Dilbert. That’s got to be funny, right? And, and it’s a lot deeper than that. But really, it’s it was kind of striking to me how little comp controversy had to be involved in something to to garner the gate name, like there’s no controversy behind those controversies behind the protest. But like, nothing scandalous happened, someone decided to throw a dildo at someone and hit him in the face. Like that’s it. No, I

Nick 40:57
mean, this dude looks like he’s from the 1950s.

Kalvin 41:01
I don’t understand why it’s not just coming up in conversation. We’re like, Hey, remember that dude, the guy hit in the face with a dildo in New Zealand. Instead of this being like a whole gate thing.

Nick 41:08
This needs to be way funnier. Or this needs to be way more viral. is trying to get well.

Kalvin 41:16
When he 16 was a rough year for viral news. Yeah, just remember that.

Nick 41:20
I mean, there’s a whole lot of dildos flying around in 2016. And she doesn’t even get slammed to the ground. Fuck this. American cops are like see this is what we don’t do. They throw dildos we fucked him up. Y’all, I highly recommend you go watch that video on YouTube. It is fucking hilarious.

Kalvin 41:42
I think I remember like, briefly hearing about it when it happened.

Nick 41:51
Oh, man. All right.

Kalvin 41:55
All right. Let’s move on to your final gate. feel like it’s a video game. You got the final gate. Your final boss

Nick 42:02
awaits. Behind this gate of latticework. So my final gate, sir, is one that is pretty close to me. Because I obviously like comic books, and I’ve talked about him a whole shitload. It’s not getting as much attention as I thought it would. And that’s comics gate, which is

Kalvin 42:24
hey, I picked comics gate

Nick 42:26
to write I think you sir. I’ve said Sir twice. Now you degenerate. You’re along the same lines as I am. And what this all what this is all about basically, is more women, people of color, people that l bgt. Q plus community,

Kalvin 42:47
anybody who’s not a white dude, basically a white, straight white dude,

Nick 42:51
right? straight white. I mean, there’s probably a lot of closeted men who are upset with themselves. But anyway, as comics have become more inclusive, and society has become more inclusive, more opportunities have been you know, awarded to people of merit, who happened to be women, people of color, etc. And a lot of these white dudes are pissed off about that, and they decided to point their finger at those situations, for the declining sales and market share of comic books in the entertainment industry.

Kalvin 43:23
People are stupid, they are so fucking that I’m so like, the single line from my computer that I took is a campaign in opposition to diversity and progressive progressivism in North American superhero comic book industry, industry. And like right off the bat, these people can just fuck all the way off anytime. The first line of your Wikipedia entry includes opposition to progressivism, you can just go to hell with whatever it is you’re doing. It doesn’t matter. I mean, like progressivism is fine, we should move forward, we should be more inclusive. The rest of this almost doesn’t matter. But like, let’s keep going. Because, you know, I kind of knew what comics gate was, I had an idea like I knew about GamerGate and comics gate kind of spawned from that, but I never really knew all of it. But I did take, you know, strenuous notes on this. So I wanted to learn more, and I want to talk about more, where it came from in that and so it’s only right that we continue to share.

Unknown Speaker 44:15

Kalvin 44:16
Because like these people are just stupid and that’s all that there is to it. But like let’s, let’s keep going how stupid they are.

Nick 44:23
Well, it it’s really. It started with something really, really simple. A female superhero Mockingbird. I had never heard of her before. I researched the whole situation. And I’ll be I’ll be forthcoming before I dive into this. They one of their biggest stances is the inclusion of women in comic books. The de sexualization of women and comic books, and having main characters new characters being represented as female, or, you know, people of color So thank you Natalie Portman as the new Thor that’s kind of the most recent thing, that and kind of.

Kalvin 45:07
So they specifically targeted creators hired characters depicted and stories they told that we’re inclusive of other genders races, sexual orientations, that basically just because they were pissed off man babies. And like, they they, like you said they allege that all this changing specific characters and things like that led to a decline in both quality and sales, but the quality has never been better. Like I read comics now. And I’ve read old comics, and like the ones now are so amazing, and so well written and so, so good. They’re, they’re thought out, right? Well, I mean, like, 19 1974 Spider Man, like it takes place in that book. But they have no idea how that’s gonna affect future books or anything like that, unless it’s a specific series. But like now that the world is built, and they they make sure that they’re fitting the world to the characters and everything like that.

Nick 46:07
They’re just, they can do so much more. Right? I mean, there’s so much talent in comic books. Until recently, like, there’s genuine. I’m looking at, I have an entire wall of comic book keys, ranging from you know, amazing Spider Man 300 to Wolverine number one to the original Raphael ninja turtle comic. The art styles are drastically different. And the more recent ones, you can really tell that these guys are expanding their game like I have, I met this gentleman named Clayton crane at a comic book convention last year. And he redid the first issue of Wolverine series from 1982. He did his own representation of the comic book cover, it’s fucking start to look at the two next to each other, I might just post a picture with y’all or posted to Twitter to show you what I’m doing in that regard. It’s fucking awesome. But this was this was a really terrible situation. So well,

Kalvin 47:10
I want to talk about the the decline in inequality and sales because quality is subjective, you know, whatever. Let’s talk about just decline in sales. Because that probably has happened. I didn’t look into it, but

Nick 47:20
dramatically just fallen off dramatically. But there’s so

Kalvin 47:23
here’s the thing, the internet exists, and comics can be shared much more easily through, you know, online sharing. There’s also a plethora of new, like, accessible indie comics and things like that. There’s there’s other places to go. Right?

Nick 47:38
Oh, absolutely. You’re

Kalvin 47:38
not just buying spider besides a million things, right?

Nick 47:42
Well, I mean, there’s there’s 10 spider man’s here’s, there’s 15 Yeah, answer is it’s impossible to keep up.

Kalvin 47:49
And so the other thing that I want to point to is mainstream movies and TV shows are now depicting people’s favorite characters in a more easily digestible way. So kids are able to see their favorite characters on TV, they have additional outlets for this content other than having to get comic books in the 70s and 80s. Like, these things weren’t really on TV or in movies. And if they were they weren’t very good like they weren’t the best versions of it. Now the best versions are in movies and on TV for a lot of people. And so there’s no reason to go pay the MCU is so vast, why am I going to go pick up a Marvel comic book that doesn’t reflect the characters I grew up on? That not me personally, but like that’s what you know, teens to 20 year olds are saying right now is they they they grew up with characters in the MCU so when they go pick up a comic book and Tony Stark is like this weird you know off on his own guy that doesn’t make any sense to them. Why are they going to read that when they want their Tony? They want Robert Downey Jr. Tony? Now No, yeah, it can’t be any of those factors has got to be that women are writing them and creating stories about women or you know, other marginalized groups that’s got to be

Nick 48:53
well, these these people fail or anything I’ve seen they’ve never mentioned once the price of a comic book. Yeah. 1970s it was 20 cents. It is 399 minimum for a comic book now. Minimum, if you could, I mean, the good key issues are 599 to 899 that shits Riddick I’ve been a comic book collector my entire life. I I’ve stopped buying comic books for the most part because that shit is ridiculous.

Kalvin 49:20
And here’s the other thing is how do you account for subscription services? Right? Marvel Unlimited DC Unlimited, where our DC ultimate or DC universe where whatever it is this week? Yeah, you just have access because you pay your $8 a month you have access to all these comics, maybe not necessarily new releases. But that’s the same thing I say when you know the people like to shout how the NFL ratings have dropped. It’s like Well, no, people are just consuming it in different ways because it’s more accessible in different ways. Nobody’s sitting there watching CBS for eight hours. There’s other ways to watch it, right. So how to sew and the The metrics haven’t caught up to those things yet. So if you’re just looking at, okay, how many hard copies of this did we sell? Yeah, that number is gonna go down. But people read it on the app that they’re already subscribed to people share it with their friends. If I buy it on an app, and I say, Hey, this is cool. I can share that with you. And you can read it without rebuy. Like, there’s all kinds of stuff that goes on. That is unaccounted for up to this point.

Nick 50:23
Absolutely. And it’s just they take up a lot of space,

Kalvin 50:26
not for damn women neck.

Nick 50:28
It’s it’s the it’s the women. And I tell you what is someone that’s been in the game for a long time? I remember back when Miles Morales was first introduced and ultimate

Kalvin 50:40
Oh, yeah.

Nick 50:42
I was a huge ultimate Spider Man fan. And I had been going in this comic book shop since I was fucking 10 years old. And this cat dropped it. very casually dropped the inward. Can’t believe Parker’s been replaced by this goddamn. Like do what? Like why is this? Why does it matter? Peter Parker

Kalvin 50:59
still exists man pick up amazing spider man. He’s there. But he’s spectacular. Spider man. He’s

Unknown Speaker 51:03
there. He’s fucking

Nick 51:04
everywhere. But this that was gone favorite. They killed him. He was dead. Yeah,

Kalvin 51:09
and ultimate. I know. But like, they’d already replaced him in 2019 I’m Miguel O’Hara, like there was more than one version, man.

Nick 51:17
Absolutely. And I think it was because it was a modern day. Basically replacement. He was an air that they didn’t deem fit. Well, it’s because he was black. It’s because he was black because he was of mixed heritage, which is fucking ridiculous when that I mean, hence the N word. But, Dude, seriously, they did not even take the time to pick up the goddamn book and read it. I remember reading that I used to have the first appearance of Miles Morales Do you know ultimate comics? Number one? ultimate comics Spider Man Miles Morales number one. That shit was on point. I mean, I sold it years later because college but yeah, you know, it’s it’s something that that that really was when I first started noticing it come into play. Like Miles Morales was really a groundbreaking character at the time. And he was so good. And that’s what paved the way for it. But I mean, people have been super pissed off about little idiotic shit

Kalvin 52:15
ever. Same thing. It’s it’s Riri Williams, it’s Jane Foster it every single time they’re replaced and the proponents of comics gate presented as a consumer protest. And like, first of all, you guys not buying the comics is, is not putting a dent in anyone’s salaries, you know, like you’re not accomplishing what you want to accomplish because people don’t give a shit what you those people have to say. They are advocating their views primarily on social media. Some have even produced books intended to reflect the group’s values. And I just, I wanted to take a break to say, wouldn’t this be the perfect money making scam if you didn’t mind being perceived as just an absolute piece of shit? Well, if you look at all these people selling books, and making YouTube videos just spouting this horrific shit, it would be so easy if like you had absolutely no morals and didn’t care what people thought.

Nick 53:14
I mean, that’s because these guys are chasing fame. There’s a lot of genuinely talented people, but there’s very few extremely, you know, above the pack type artists and stuff like that. Most of these pissed off people are on, you know, independent publishers, low grade comic, you know, comic distributors, stuff like that. That is I think one guy they just know

Kalvin 53:38
that they just know if they rile up the right people, those people will give them money,

Nick 53:42
right? Exactly. That’s their bread and butter because they can’t make it otherwise they

Kalvin 53:45
they play to the lowest common denominator of these All right, man babies, you know, it would just be so simple. And then they prop up anyone who’s willing to spout their values like they just they bring them to the top of their little circle and it’s the stupidest thing and like I think a lot of these people that are selling stuff to this base don’t even have strong convictions about any of it like they don’t give a shit if women are doing it they just as you said they they know it’s a way to quote unquote stardom. They know it’s a way that people will pay attention to them and listen to them. And it’s just super easy for them to spew bullshit hate. And these morons just lap it up and they throw all their money at them.

Nick 54:22
Well fuck do when you think about it. How can you equate Okay, they’re reducing the size of women’s breasts and and comics. That’s restricting your freedom of speech. This is like Dude, what

Kalvin 54:34
are the internet is man go look at porn. It’s fine.

Nick 54:37
These are right exactly. This is a drawing. Just because they’re you know a lot that’s what that’s really what what got me about comics gate or just little shit like that. Just not hyper sexualizing every woman character because it’s like, God damn it seriously.

You’re upset about that? Do none of you have daughters? None of you.

Kalvin 55:00
What does it matter? Like? I don’t know. I like to read comics and and I like the, you know, stylized artwork that goes into them. But it’s, I don’t pay that close attention to it. Like I see the pictures but then might like my mind kind of moves through the story rather than like focusing on and I’m definitely not opening up to page 13 and just being like, Damn, no who’s got some nice boobs? She Hulk

Unknown Speaker 55:24
I was just like, she hope to

Nick 55:29
get you in mind Calvin. No, I didn’t fucking weird.

Kalvin 55:33
This kind of con literally got the last president elected. That’s the point I’m trying to make here is like, if you don’t care, it’s would be so easy to get into this. And I think it’s time we just ditch this podcast, Nick and start making YouTube videos about how women are ruining everything. I think we can make a ton of money off of it.

Nick 55:50
I mean, probably until we got canceled for you know, just express

Kalvin 55:56
my seat. No, you get cancelled. They give you even more money. Look at Gina Carano they’re just throwing money at her because she’s stupid

Nick 56:04
for like an hour and then she’s gonna be broke. That’s

Kalvin 56:06
fine. But you get all that money still. What’s something that women haven’t ruined yet? I feel like all the good stuff is taking podcasting. I think that could be our angle.

Unknown Speaker 56:18
Yeah, you know,

Nick 56:19
totally the office ladies podcast.

Kalvin 56:24
That’s not very good. I don’t like the office. I’m not a fan of it. I’m

Nick 56:27
sorry. There’s no,

Kalvin 56:28
but it’s not because women are doing is like it’s not interesting to me. But no, not at all. I’m sorry, the way it’s presented is not interesting.

Nick 56:36
I just don’t find them all that funny.

Kalvin 56:38
No, they are I’m not going to get into it because then we’re gonna come off as as these people that we were gonna start this thing that they’re ruining podcasting, but I don’t think

Nick 56:49
big I can’t even listen. God.

Kalvin 56:52
There’s so many wonderful women podcasters out there, but I feel like we could really just take shots if we needed to and make a lot of money that way. I mean, we podcasting was a great game until women got into it.

Nick 57:02
Yeah, they just threw everything off with their breasts in there.

Kalvin 57:06
How do you get your mouth close enough to a microphone when your breasts are swiveling in the way

Nick 57:11
so I can hear is bouncing is unbelievable. This podcast sucks one star

Kalvin 57:19
so back to comic skate has been described as a harassment campaign with roots and the alt right. Harassment with the alt right movement which targets women people of color and LGBT folks in the comic book industry it has been blamed by critics for vandalism of at least one store and several accounts of threats of violence.

Unknown Speaker 57:37
Yeah, dude. really disappointing about that.

Kalvin 57:42
People are stupid man. Members of the lumut object to the diversification of comics especially increasing inclusion of women as writers and characters and this is what you kind of pointed to the all new all different run by Marvel took a great deal of heat from these types of idiots. In this arc, all new all different male white male superheroes were replaced temporarily. Keyword there temporarily by female and or racial minority characters as included Wolverine, Thor, Hulk, Captain America, Spider Man, several others.

Unknown Speaker 58:13
Yeah, it’s really fucking dumb.

Kalvin 58:16
If you’re complaining about a change in a comic book series, to the point where you’re harassing creators, you’ve got some major issues and you probably need to seek therapy as well. I mean, really just seek therapy on anything if you’re designed to harass creators or actors on the internet for piece of shit points, like just yet like, you need to talk to somebody for real serious, not not just be on your Reddit circle jerk boards, just but stroking

Nick 58:39
your ego like a fuck.

Kalvin 58:41
comic book characters change all the goddamn time and the changes never ever stick. The real character always comes back. Oh, like that is the biggest thing and like whatever change happens, it’s either temporary or gets spinned off into its own thing. Like that. The changes like they spin off. And the reason I like I think this is part of the reason that comic books have been able to sustain this long right they you take your main character you beat them down in prison them D power em or you know, heavy air quotes here kill these characters, so they can tell a new story for a few months, and then they bring them back so they can tell that story again, because those are the stories that sell best when the hero is at their lowest point. And when the hero makes their triumphant return. That’s what people want to read about the day to day monster of the week stuff. It’s fun, but it’s not gonna move copies right? So you have to have these big events where something drastic changes and so for anyone to take these drastic changes as well this is just going to be the new way it is forever. I better go yell at people. You’re just being stupid and you’re being stupid on purpose.

Unknown Speaker 59:44
It’s just stupid and shitty to fellow human beings for Yeah, right on purpose to

Unknown Speaker 59:49
fucking family get

Nick 59:51
hysterical statement that makes zero sense.

Kalvin 59:56
I just if you don’t like these changes, just don’t read that off to wait a couple more. Until it spins off into its own thing and they bring the regular person back you get your favorite homoerotic white man back in his very tight spandex. That’s all you really want. See? That’s

Nick 1:00:09
I mean, it all boils down to that a lot of the time i think

Kalvin 1:00:14
i don’t know i i think they just want to complain they like hearing themselves in their echo chamber and all that it’s

Nick 1:00:23
what it strikes me as man Yeah, in all honesty, it’s fucking depressing and that’s, that’s what’s really turned me away from I there were two comic book shops in town that I really enjoyed going to a third one I would go to 1000 desperate ran by this old Greek dude who never trained should make it clear what the fuck his name was, but he stunk like audience all the time. I was like, man, I really want to go in there. But he had some dope back issues. So and then there was big j, who was the fellow dropping the N word. And then there was another I am going to shout these folks out killing enterprise. They are fantastic. They are hyper inclusive. So they just they basically promote any new, you know, main character that’s come out as a woman like I remember iron heart number one was like their landmark issue when they open their new store, and they had that shit fucking everywhere.

Kalvin 1:01:24
So red iron, heart comics, but like the Riri Williams Iron Man suit looks awesome.

Nick 1:01:30
It’s fantastic. I love the aesthetic. I’m not a fan of AI. As I’ve aged,

Kalvin 1:01:34
I haven’t read I haven’t changed. Yeah, I have no thoughts on the character. But like, I think it’s a cool idea that they brought in this new person that represents something other than what Tony Stark represents?

Nick 1:01:46
Well, you need fresh blood. I mean, it’s you have to have fresh blood. The only thing I think, you know, I can say for myself is I don’t care what color you know, whatever they are, I do not give a shit as long as they’re compelling.

Kalvin 1:02:01
Right. And that’s the that’s the important part. All the commentators also complained about stories dealing with current social justice issues, obviously. And the depiction of women with sexualized figures, which is what you hinted at earlier. You know, we can have women in our comics, but only if they’re super Boehner material. She Hulk on page 13 you guys know what I’m talking about? Well, I

Nick 1:02:20
mean, you can look at rogue from the 90s x men. You know, she like Jesus Christ, dude. She’s got

Kalvin 1:02:29
to have that super strength to hold that body up. So let’s talk about let’s go back to Mockingbird. I know you hinted at that earlier, but I finally got through all my stuff that I had before Mockingbird so So Mark, what do we got on Mockingbird

Nick 1:02:43
in 2016, was depicted on a comic cover wearing a T shirt. The red asked me about my feminist agenda. So series writer Chelsea Kane was harassed, unbelievably bad. And had someone even took the time to illustrate a depiction of Mockingbird, beaten to death with their costume torn off with a T shirt phrase as the caption so that the phrase asked me about my feminist agenda. Hovering over a Brian you know, hero that was basically beat to death

Kalvin 1:03:20
from for a T shirt on a cover of a book that was about something else, like she was wearing that T shirt.

Nick 1:03:28
I don’t I mean, is it a dope cover? Yes or no if I don’t plan on that’s that’s kind of my point is a comic book collector. And then it just started going from there because I think that was there first. Someone posted that then they got some traction and in July 2017 back on, you know, social media, a post made by health Who? Heather antas

Kalvin 1:03:53
maybe I just spelled it wrong. I have I think it is Santos Yeah, I think it’s antas.

Nick 1:03:58
But they were commemorating Flo Steinberg who was one of the longest tenured Marvel employees ever. Basically, she was called a diversity hiber Well,

Unknown Speaker 1:04:10
let’s let’s

Kalvin 1:04:12
she took a picture and posted on Twitter of herself and several young female co workers getting milkshakes like that was it

Nick 1:04:19
but they worked for Marvel Calvin, there’s women that man that work at fucking Marvel, are you serious?

Kalvin 1:04:26
And yet they were out having the milkshakes to celebrate the person that you pointed out, but she just posted the picture of them having mochi like very simple thing here. And yeah, that that got some very harsh responses for something so incredibly banal. It’s just

Nick 1:04:41
downright hateful. This is just a bit of what was thrown at these ladies diversity hire an unqualified bimbo, the false rape charge type, fake geek girls tumbler virtue cygnar signalers the creepiest collection of stereotypical SJ data We use anyone can possibly imagine, and more including rape threats being doxxed and Prolog campaigns of online harassment that is so fucked up, dude.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:11
Your life people,

Unknown Speaker 1:05:13
what the fuck? What

Unknown Speaker 1:05:14
is wrong with you?

Unknown Speaker 1:05:15
What is wrong with you?

Nick 1:05:19
It’s amazing to me, Kelly, if you’re one of these people listening to the show, sincerely Fuck you. And I want to know, please just,

Unknown Speaker 1:05:28
I mean, reach out, let

Nick 1:05:29
me know why are you the way that you are?

Kalvin 1:05:32
I was like, why are you the way that you are? I was gonna highlight some of those people. And now I don’t really first we’re running long on time. So we need to start wrapping this up. And I don’t really want to pay attention to these people and give them any more. I mean, it’s not credit, but just many more spotlight than they deserve.

Nick 1:05:50
Right? correct them.

Kalvin 1:05:51
So if you really want to learn about the pieces of shit who perpetuate this on YouTube and write books about it, go to the comic skate Wikipedia page, you can learn all about them want to learn many comics professionals have chosen to ignore comics gate to avoid giving publicity in the same way we kind of just did. It has been met with widespread criticism from the readers, comics creators and industry journalists. So there we go.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:14
Some of them

Nick 1:06:16
let me go ahead and throw out Scott Snyder. Very, uh, he teaches classes in college and does a lot of empowering of women and people of color, etc, to join the comic book industry. And he penned a very poignant letter, which I found great.

Kalvin 1:06:39
So let’s move on to our favorite part of the episode. What would you do? Nick? Have you ever been involved in a real scandal that with a gate or otherwise,

Nick 1:06:47
I have? This is highly embarrassing. This is this might be the most embarrassing thing that’s ever happened to me in my while. Okay, so it was just called gate. g a YT. gate? Not because I’m gay.

Kalvin 1:07:08
I’m just gonna throw that out there. All you Not that there’s anything wrong with that? No, there’s

Nick 1:07:11
not. But you know, all these guys chomping at the bit.

Kalvin 1:07:14
Oh, there is. Look, there is a gate gate. Gate. point that out from 2012 gate.

Nick 1:07:20
Anyway, so this is my sophomore year of high school. And I am in the auditorium with the entire freshman class because I was taking a freshman Spanish class because I flunked out of Latin. So, Latin stuff. No, dude, it’s fucking I had to take it as a transfer student so I could play football. And then I was just like, you know, fuck this shit. So I have to go join the auditorium. There’s probably 450 500 freshmen kids in there. And I’m sitting behind a row of kids. Right next to my other sophomore friend of mine named Caleb fucking escape.

Kalvin 1:08:01
Well, back shout out.

Nick 1:08:03
Yeah, river shadow back then. A lot of insults thrown around where you’re gay or right. You know, that’s fucking gay or stupid shit like that. So during the it was for class president, I believe so these kids are given their speeches for class president. And here I am calling my buddy gay. Mike. You’re being fucking gay right now. Like, you should really cut that out because he kept talking super loud. And it’s like, I’m, I don’t want to listen to what the fuck you’re talking about. He was really annoying. Fuck that kid. And so I’m sitting there and I say it one more time during a quiet portion of the speech. And I remember this shit so vividly. This kid in front of me, stands up and screams. I’m not any reaches. fuckin chairs, dude, grabs me by my shirt, rips my shirt open, and then punches me in the face. So here’s the thing

Kalvin 1:09:03
they deserve. But

Nick 1:09:04
here’s the kicker. This kid is 90 pounds. And autistic. So he

Kalvin 1:09:13
sounds like you deserve it. Nick.

Nick 1:09:14
He heard me calling my buddy gay and thought I was calling him gay. I was not calling an autistic child gay. Do you? Fuck you. That’s what I’m saying. I was sitting next to my buddy and I was talking shit to him. And this kid in front of me overheard me saying that and thought I was calling him gay. And then he stood up and reached over ripped off my shirt and then Paul anyway, it’s

Kalvin 1:09:36
not a very woke insult. Dog. You get it? Yes, I understand where you’re picking up where you put now. Right haven’t really I tried to think and I can’t think of anything that you can really live up to a scandal. No, I don’t I definitely can’t beat that. I think oh, I can delete the whole thing.

Nick 1:09:59
Yeah. Just fucking

Kalvin 1:10:01
one people. Yeah, you know I was in this one scandal.

Unknown Speaker 1:10:05
I thought I was

Nick 1:10:07
explaining it well enough that you didn’t think I was calling a autistic child gay. That’s my favorite shirt to man. That was like one of the last things my mom ever bought me was this dope ass Jimi Hendrix shirt and he ripped it in half and punched me in the face and all I could do is just be like I’m not touching him. This fucking 90 pounds

Kalvin 1:10:30
Yeah, I I can’t think of anything. I did so I had to sit on the fence one time in kindergarten. I don’t remember what that was for though.

Unknown Speaker 1:10:41
Sit on the fence.

Kalvin 1:10:42
Yeah, that was like the during recess. You had to sit on the fence while all the other kids played for like 10 minutes.

Nick 1:10:48
Like, did I have a bench?

Kalvin 1:10:51
No. But yeah, around next to the fan.

Nick 1:10:54
Oh, I put you on a fence.

Kalvin 1:10:58
Like a chain link fence fucking next to the fence. Making

Nick 1:11:03
you sit on fences. You’re poor but dude what

Kalvin 1:11:05
we did in our Madden Li we had a player admit that he quit a game because their quarterback Matt Stafford got hurt for the seat like you it was third game of the season or somebody got hurt for the season. So he quit and restarted it so the injury wouldn’t happen. So for the rest of the season, we had dubbed that Stafford gate in our group chat. That’s about as close as I get to having actual gate scandal,

Nick 1:11:26
I think Nice. Yeah, that’s much better than mine.

Kalvin 1:11:30
It’s much tamer than yours for sure that nobody got punched in the face yet. overstaying he tried. He was

Nick 1:11:35
like he was like Drew Brees thrown a pass. He was like fucking glass. It is.

Unknown Speaker 1:11:43

Kalvin 1:11:44
So in your opinion, what’s the dumbest use of the gate suffix for a scandal? Wherever a lot of choose from?

Nick 1:11:50
How much time do I have? I really think Frankie gay and Franklin gate are probably the dumbest. Like would this guy do to you?

Kalvin 1:11:59
Yeah. What? What’s up? Uh, Frank, I think all of them are not a fan of the gate suffix, especially the ones where they take like a random simple thing regarding the scandal and then tack gate on the end. Like, they just go to the lowest common denominator these things right. The tech section of the Wikipedia page is just riddled with these. They’ve got antenna gate, email, gate, elbow, gate, shirt, gate, note, gate, location, gate, pen gate. Those can be literally anything. They tell nothing about what the gate scandal actually is. They’re just like, oh, they’re a random, everyday word with gate on it.

Nick 1:12:33
Right. I mean, I remember that was thrown around very cavalierly when Obama was in office.

Unknown Speaker 1:12:39
Yeah, fucking khaki gate,

Nick 1:12:40
right. That was a terrible suit though. I’m sorry. My God. Love you Brockway. That suit look terrible on you.

Kalvin 1:12:47
Like as stupid as the controversy was deflate gate at least has some pizzazz in his name like it described what was going on pin gate doesn’t describe anything knows something like lunatic gate if you’re going to use this stupid naming convention that only makes sense in exactly one situation. Like at least go for the gold let’s let’s think of nice thing note gate. One of the ones I mentioned earlier, that was the controversy surrounding the Samsung Galaxy Note fat phones spontaneously combust. like would you have thought? No, I can’t you’re talking about notes. like writing notes. Yeah, right. There are so many better names you could come up with here. You got combustor gate, phone explodey Gate, plane smoke gate, like those are just off top my head like let’s get something that actually

Nick 1:13:31
that just sounds even doper because it’s another galaxy when it kills you by setting you on fire by spontaneously combusting.

Kalvin 1:13:41
Why do you think every dumb thing that’s ever happened in the history of the world and language and could have been adopted for scandals? Why do you think the gate suffix is the thing that has persisted? That one fucking dude. Like he propagated it early. And it’s just kind of been inherent since then. And when you open up with a bang like Watergate and that’s just don’t really like it because like the gate did not like what what it was called

Nick 1:14:10
Watergate though, but it just I don’t know. It sounds better than hotel. disaster. It’s catchy. The Watergate.

Kalvin 1:14:19
Well, the Watergate scandal makes sense like saying the Watergate scandal that makes sense because it happened at Watergate. But saying deflate gate doesn’t make sense because there’s no gate in the deflate. He could have just been like the New England Patriots deflating scandal.

Nick 1:14:34
Yeah, but you know exactly what they were talking about when you said the flight gate, though.

Kalvin 1:14:38
But I don’t know what they’re talking about when they say note gate.

Nick 1:14:41
That’s good point. It’s very ambiguous.

Kalvin 1:14:44
I think it’s just he I agree with, you know, Mr. Sapphire, who just propagated it and built it up and built it up and got to the point that he that he wanted, and it’s easy, and it’s now become something more than what it was starting people like easy things when you can just pick something random permanence and an add gate to the end of it. It’s just a shortcut to making something more memorable than it probably should have been.

Nick 1:15:05
Dude, it’s like the vocabulary term for pet rock. It’s basically the same fucking equivalency there. It’s a pet rock. And people pay you just people don’t have to pay for it. So it’s, you know, propagated a little more.

Kalvin 1:15:20
I Yeah, and I think a lot of things on the list here, they would have been instantly forgotten without the gate moniker. And yet they persist in the cultural consciousness now because of, you know, there’s a lot of things that are out there like Spygate, you know, the the New England Patriots filming practices of the Jets or whatever the hell they were doing there? Like I I don’t think anybody would talk about that if it wasn’t titled Spygate.

Nick 1:15:45
No. I mean, I would not give a shit. That’s how I really fucking knows. We don’t play him. So

Kalvin 1:15:53
fuck, well. No, because the bears don’t get to the playoffs that often. So Dude, I had to you sign up for that one.

Nick 1:16:01
I did. But Soldier Field fucking in Italian beef. drinking some beers.

Kalvin 1:16:10
That’s nice. Do you have anything more on gates?

Nick 1:16:13
Oh my god. Calvin. You’re Savage. That’s nice. Idiot.

Unknown Speaker 1:16:20
about Bill Gates.

Nick 1:16:22
Don’t even get me started on that piece of shit. who just

Kalvin 1:16:25
got his chip on you, Tony. chip in you now you got that vaccine. I

Nick 1:16:29
was terrible. I did folks get vaccinated if you can. It’s very safe. I’ll just give you a quick speaking of gate vaccine gate. You don’t turn gay. And you don’t die. Um, let me throw that out there. I had a little soreness in my shoulder after the first one. And then we’ll see how I feel. Pretty bad point.

Kalvin 1:16:52
You got that shoulder pain you might as well be dead at that point.

Nick 1:16:55
I would do it it’s all pretty good. Like it was the size of like a golf ball. The tennis

Kalvin 1:17:00
shot was always the worst of leaving like that lasting tall pain that hurt. Yeah, that’s great. Good to know. Can’t wait.

Nick 1:17:08
It’s this was really easy. It was nothing.

Kalvin 1:17:12
After you get vaccinated Follow us on Twitter at APA something at alone underscore podcast check out all the cool stuff there. I can sign up for our monthly newsletter that is in the show description down there it says monthly newsletter just click on a link put in your email address. We’ll send you cool shit. Oh yeah. In the email not like anything real. Yeah, the checkout t public store just search podcast about something you’ll find us over there. And thanks always to those cats for all the music for a podcast about something. You guys

Nick 1:17:42
say sassy

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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